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[USA] SJEDINJENE AMERIČKE DRŽAVE - unutrašnja politika i uticaj na svetska kretanja


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2 hours ago, Sunshine State said:

 

Pa kad nije mogao da kupi pivo, jer nema 21!!

 

Sick, sick!!!

Nazalost, moze I u rat da ide da pogine, ali cigare I pivo, nista. Kako se ovako bolesna deca provuku kroz skolski sistem da niko ne primeti I ne reaguje?

Onaj prethodni je bukvalno na pitanje sta planira za raspust rekao "ubistvo I samoubistvo", poslali ga na razgovor kod skolskog savetnika, rekao da se salio...I nista.

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1 hour ago, Angelia said:

Nazalost, moze I u rat da ide da pogine, ali cigare I pivo, nista. Kako se ovako bolesna deca provuku kroz skolski sistem da niko ne primeti I ne reaguje?

Onaj prethodni je bukvalno na pitanje sta planira za raspust rekao "ubistvo I samoubistvo", poslali ga na razgovor kod skolskog savetnika, rekao da se salio...I nista.

 

biće da problem leži negde drugde

 

Spoiler

 

steve kerr / dubs coach i racionalan čovek:

 

I’m not going to talk about basketball. Nothing’s happened with our team in the last six hours. We’re going to start the same way tonight. Any basketball questions don’t matter.

Since we left shootaround, 14 children were killed 400 miles from here, and a teacher. In the last 10 days, we’ve had elderly Black people killed in a supermarket in Buffalo, we’ve had Asian churchgoers killed in Southern California, now we have children murdered at school. When are we going to do something? I’m tired. I’m so tired of getting up here and offering condolences to the devastated families that are out there. I’m so tired. Excuse me. I’m sorry. I’m tired of the moments of silence. Enough.

There’s 50 Senators right now who refuse to vote on HR8, which is a background check rule that the House passed a couple years ago. It’s been sitting there for two years. There’s a reason they won’t vote on it: to hold onto power. I ask you, Mitch McConnell, all of you Senators who refuse to do anything about the violence, school shootings, supermarket shootings, I ask you: Are you going to put your own desire for power ahead of the lives of our children and our elderly and our churchgoers? Because that’s what it looks like. That’s what we do every week. So I’m fed up. I’ve had enough.

We’re going to play the game tonight. But I want every person here, every person listening to this, to think about your own child or grandchild, mother or father, sister, brother. How would you feel if this happened to you today? We can’t get numb to this. We can’t sit here and just read about it and go, well, let’s have a moment of silence. Go Dubs. C’mon, Mavs, let’s go.

That’s what we’re going to do. We’re going to go play a basketball game. 50 Senators in Washington are going to hold us hostage. Do you realize that 90 percent of Americans, regardless of political party, want background checks, universal background checks? 90% of us. We are being held hostage by 50 Senators in Washington who refuse to even put it to a vote, despite what we the American people want. They won’t vote on it because they want to hold onto their own power.

It’s pathetic. I’ve had enough.

 

 

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Ne vidim zasto bi bilo kom civilu trebale "puske i mitraljezi"?

 

Pistolj im nije dovoljan?

 

Ograniciti prodaju oruzja samo na pistolje i neke lovacke puske, ako vec insistiraju na ustavnom pravu da nose oruzje - s njima ne mogu pobiti toliko ljudi odjednom.

Prodati 18-godisnjaku AR15!!! Za cega?

 

A photo of two AR15-style rifles appeared on an Instagram account tied to the suspected Uvalde shooter just three days before Tuesday’s massacre.

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6 hours ago, Baby said:

Pa evo, valjda cemo videti kakva ce biti pravila i kako ce to ici, posto ce ga izgleda primorati da se drzi ugovora koji je potpisao. 

 

Hocu reci, poceo je da pise kako ga progone po twitteru, pa, eto, sloboda govora na delu, ali nije tako lepa na sopstvenoj kozi.... nisam bas sigurna da ce ispuniti vasa ocekivanja. 

Opet ovo. Sloboda govora na tviteru bi značila manje banovanja i ostale cenzure od strane platforme. Korisnici su slobodni da se svađaju, vređaju i budu uvređeni, blokiraju, rage kvituju i štagod im padne na pamet osim što manjeg seta ponašanja koje je i inače zabranjeno. 

 

43 minutes ago, Sunshine State said:

Pistolj im nije dovoljan?

Mrzi me da proveravam ali mislim da su pištolji odgovorni za (daleko) veći broj ubistava od kvazi assault rifles.

Edited by Cyrus Smith
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12 minutes ago, Cyrus Smith said:

Mrzi me da proveravam ali mislim da su pištolji odgovorni za (daleko) veći broj ubistava od kvazi assault rifles.

 

I automobili su odgovorniji za mnogo veci broj poginulih nego avioni - opet, kad padne avion pise se mnogo vise o tom, nego o svim automobilskim nesrecama zajedno

 

Ubistva po Cikagu (gangs) me bas i ne zanimaju - zanima me koliko nevinih zrtava moze da ubije jedan ludak s pistoljem, a koliko jedan ludak s dva AR15?

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Dokle god se raspravlja da li je kriv zakon ili obrazovni sistem, tapka se u mestu i gubi se vreme, nevini stradaju.

 

Odgovornost snose oba, u kojoj meri nije ni bitno jer oba treba popraviti/izmeniti. Izmenom zakona o dostupnosti oruzja bi efekti bili brzi, sto ne znaci da ne treba da se radi i na drugim stvarima. Ne iskljucuje jedno drugo. 

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34 minutes ago, Sunshine State said:

I automobili su odgovorniji za mnogo veci broj poginulih nego avioni - opet, kad padne avion pise se mnogo vise o tom, nego o svim automobilskim nesrecama zajedno

Na psihološkom nivou to je razumljivo i ok. Na nivou vođenja politike ispada da bi trebalo zabraniti avione  i to nije ok.

 

34 minutes ago, Sunshine State said:

Ubistva po Cikagu (gangs) me bas i ne zanimaju - zanima me koliko nevinih zrtava moze da ubije jedan ludak s pistoljem, a koliko jedan ludak s dva AR15?

I ovo je ok na srpskom forumu. Na američkom otvara bok za napad zbog rasizma. Ne zanimaju te ubistva po Čikagu gde uglavnom stradaju crnci? Check Your Privilege.

 

Takođe, opet nemam brojke pri ruci, dobar deo nastradalih u tim pucnjavama pištoljima su kolateralna šteta, često deca:

 

 

 

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9 minutes ago, Cyrus Smith said:

ovo je ok na srpskom forumu. Na američkom otvara bok za napad zbog rasizma. Ne zanimaju te ubistva po Čikagu gde uglavnom stradaju crnci? Check Your Privilege.

 

Ne, vec me u prici o masovnim ubistvima manje zanimaju ubistva pistoljima, pucali belci, crnci, Latinosi..... 

Sorry, ti si u pricu ubacio crnce, ne ja! Ja sam napisala gangs!

 

Btw, vecinu mass shootings, koji su predmet razgovora, su pociinili belci, tako da me ne prozivas za rasizam 

 

Edited by Sunshine State
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25 minutes ago, Cyrus Smith said:

Na nivou vođenja politike ispada da bi trebalo zabraniti avione  i to nije ok.

Ne, nego ispada da treba da se uradi analiza koji avioni najvise padaju, zasto, kako.... pa izvuci zakljucke sta moze da se promeni/poboljsa da ne padaju 

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21 minutes ago, Sunshine State said:

 

Ne, vec me u prici o masovnim ubistvima manje zanimaju ubistva pistoljima, pucali belci, crnci, Latinosi..... 

Sorry, ti si u pricu ubacio crnce, ne ja! Ja sam napisala gangs!

 

Btw, vecinu mass shootings, koji su predmet razgovora, su pociinili belci, tako da me ne prozivas za rasizam 

 

Prvi bold (moj): ne prozivam te nizašta, lepo piše "otvara se bok" i "američki forum". Na jednostavnom primeru pokazujem kako to ide trenutno u USA i kako je lako moguće izbušiti i ta opšta mesta za koja se svako ko sebe smatra progresivnim odmah hvata. Otud i crnci gde im mesto nije. 

 

To sa mass shootings i belcima je takođe komplikovanije nego što izgleda. Zavisi od definicije, kao i skoro sve drugo. Belci su nadzastupljeni samo u jednoj usko definisanoj kategoriji, moraš dosta reči da potrošiš da tu kategoriju opišeš. Ako se uzme najjednostavnija definicija sa 3 (5, 6, ...) upucanih u jednoj pucnjavi stvari se svedu na približno jednaku zastupljenost rase pucača i opšte populacije.

 

Usput, ovaj je bio latino na veliku žalost nekih militantnih "antirasista".

 

2 minutes ago, Kooineeperk said:

Auh kakav pokusaj ucitavanja rasizma 😕 

 

Vau, a  da ja sad trebe optužim za simpovanje? Nema većeg pravedničkog ega od progresivca sa misijom. 

3 minutes ago, Sunshine State said:

Ne, nego ispada da treba da se uradi analiza koji avioni najvise padaju, zasto, kako.... pa izvuci zakljucke sta moze da se promeni/poboljsa da ne padaju 

Pa evo ti analiza, najviše se strada od običnih pištolja, uračunaj decu iz onog tviter treda. 

Edited by Cyrus Smith
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3 minutes ago, Cyrus Smith said:

Ako se uzme najjednostavnija definicija sa 3 (5, 6, ...) upucanih u jednoj pucnjavi stvari se svedu na približno jednaku zastupljenost rase pucača i opšte populacije.

 

Odradjene i studije, nema sta da se mi pitamo - zna se sta racunaju u mass shootings, i evo i nekih info:

 

A mass shooting is an incident of targeted violence carried out by one or more shooters at one or more public or populated locations. Multiple victims (both injuries and fatalities) are associated with the attack, and both the victims and location(s) are chosen either at random or for their symbolic value. The event occurs within a single 24-hour period, though most attacks typically last only a few minutes. The motivation of the shooting must not correlate with gang violence or targeted militant or terroristic activity.*

 

"The stereotype of a mass shooter is a white male with a history of mental illness or domestic violence. While that may be anecdotally true, the largest single study of mass shooters ever funded by the U.S. government has found that nearly all mass shooters have four specific things in common.

A new Department of Justice-funded study of all mass shootings — killings of four or more people in a public place — since 1966 found that the shooters typically have an experience with childhood trauma, a personal crisis or specific grievance, and a “script” or examples that validate their feelings or provide a roadmap. And then there’s the fourth thing: access to a firearm.

 

 

Mass shootings have been increasing in frequency since 1966

1966-1975

12 mass shootings

2011-2020

160 mass shootings

 

95.7% of perpetrators were male

54.8% of perpetrators were white

 

 

 

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14 minutes ago, Cyrus Smith said:

Pa evo ti analiza, najviše se strada od običnih pištolja, uračunaj decu iz onog tviter treda. 

 

Cekaj, da li je tebi stvarno noralno da 18-godisnjak ne moze da kupi pivo, ali moze da ode i kupi dva AR15?

 

I da drzava ne moze nista da uradi po tom pitanju? Ono - uklesano u kamenu?

 

 

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12 minutes ago, Cyrus Smith said:

Vau, a  da ja sad trebe optužim za simpovanje? Nema većeg pravedničkog ega od progresivca sa misijom. 

Ne nalazim se prozvanim u tvojim recima iako si me citirao. 

 

Samo sam dao svoje misljenje o tome kako si od gangs dosao do rasizma - ako nije pokusaj ucitavanja onda primi moje izvinjenje. A vidi, neko moze smatrati da je to tvoje izjednacavanje gangs i afroamerikanaca zapravo rasizam, i sta onda?

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Paul Krugman, American economist and public intellectual:

 

"In a different time zone, so I woke up to the Uvalde news. As usual, the people making such things possible are demanding that we refrain from politicizing the horror. Hell no. Unrestricted access to deadly weapons is a political choice, and we should say it"

 

"U drugoj vremenskoj zoni, pa sam se probudio sa vestima o Uvaldeu. Kao i obično, ljudi koji omogućavaju takve stvari zahtevaju da se uzdržimo od politizacije užasa. Do đavola ne. Neograničen pristup smrtonosnom oružju je politički izbor, i to treba da kažemo

 

Da bismo zastitili sve potencijalno ranjive (skole, supermarkete, trzne centre) dakle, da bi se „očvrsnule ove mete“, na šta je Dan Patrik pozvao sinoć,  bila bi potrebna vojna snaga veća od Korpusa marinaca, koji ima oko 180.000 pripadnika. I da, vojna sila; zapamtite, pancir"

 

 

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"For nearly a decade, his chief fight in Congress has been a campaign to pass universal gun background check legislation. Passed by the House, the bill has died repeatedly in the Senate.

Thompson aimed harsh words Tuesday at those standing in its way.

“What that boils down to is, there’s too many gutless senators sitting on their hands instead of taking action that will save lives,” said Thompson, the North Bay’s senior congressman."

 

Thompson, a Vietnam War veteran and lifelong hunter, first introduced his universal background checks bill in 2013. It would close a long-standing loophole in existing laws by expanding background checks to those purchasing weapons over the internet, at gun shows and through certain private transactions.

The House has passed it twice, most recently in March 2021. But it has languished in the Senate, where 60 members are needed to avoid a filibuster and advance the legislation to a vote.

 

Rep. Thompson blasts ‘gutless’ GOP senators blocking gun background check bill after deadly Texas school shooting

 

 

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7 hours ago, uini said:

 

biće da problem leži negde drugde

 

 

Pa jbga morali bi da prvo promene godiste regrutacije. pa da menjaju background check za koji ne postoji vecina...

 

Za to vreme skole se bave gender identity a prosli im ovakvi slucajevi.

6 hours ago, Sunshine State said:

Ne vidim zasto bi bilo kom civilu trebale "puske i mitraljezi"?

 

Pistolj im nije dovoljan?

 

Ograniciti prodaju oruzja samo na pistolje i neke lovacke puske, ako vec insistiraju na ustavnom pravu da nose oruzje - s njima ne mogu pobiti toliko ljudi odjednom.

Prodati 18-godisnjaku AR15!!! Za cega?

 

A photo of two AR15-style rifles appeared on an Instagram account tied to the suspected Uvalde shooter just three days before Tuesday’s massacre.

To sto pricas je protivustavno. Drugi amandman je jasan po tom pitanju, da imaju pravo da kupe oruzje da se brane od tiranije. To definitivno nije pistolj i lovacka puska.

Prosto nemas vecinu koja podrzava ni background check.

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12 minutes ago, Baby said:

 

Ovo je samo izgovor. Najveci tirani su upravo oni a rezultat njihovog "branjenja" je stotine i stotine mrtvih godisnje izmedjkojih su i deca iz osnovne skole. 

Nije izgovor, to su osnovni postulati na kojima americki sistem funkcionise. Prosto za to nemas koncenzus. Zato sto je amerima jos uvek bitnija sloboda.

Ja se slazem da bi background check trebao da bude bolji, ali sistem za to ne postoji. Odgovor nije "treba zabraniti oruzje" jer se oruzje svejedno moze kupiti.

 

Lakse bi bilo da skole rade bolji posao po pitanju otkrivanja ovakvih slucajeva, i bolji mental care, za to je lakse postici koncenzus.

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13 minutes ago, Angelia said:

Lakse bi bilo da skole rade bolji posao po pitanju otkrivanja ovakvih slucajeva, i bolji mental care, za to je lakse postici koncenzus.

 

hit parade. nije problem oružje na trafici, to je sloboda, nego škole da rade bolji posao pri otkrivanju ludaka. genijalno.

ujedno i tužno što smatraš da je sloboda posedovati oružje tek tako zatp što je neko u kamenom dobu amerike to provalio kao fazon.

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