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[USA] SJEDINJENE AMERIČKE DRŽAVE - unutrašnja politika i uticaj na svetska kretanja

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A u koju to drzavu odlaze obrazovani Evropljani i otkud toliko "belih" Amerikanaca europskog porekla u SAD, ako je tamo truba, a u Europi raj? Zasto Afroamerikanci ne pobegnu u EU, da se spasu zle Amerike? Zasto je SAD nativnim Afrikancima isto prvi izbor? Kada ce Europa imati nekog Afroamerikanca za predsednika (lol, nikad)? Zasto lekari i sestre (entre otros, x supuesto) iz Nemacke odlaze u zlu, kapitalisticku Ameriku, kad je u Nemackoj - - guess what - - manja nejednakost medju klasama, bas raj sudeci po vama levicarima? Zasto sebe muciti medju "rasistima" (sic!), umesto uživati u carima napredne, welfare Europe? 

 

Farid Zakarija je u knjizi Postamericki svet dao fin podatak (doduse o muslimanskim sentimentima, sto jos vise dobija na znacaju), radjen na meta podacima - - oko ~75% muslimanskih Amerikanaca je dalo potvrdan odgovor na pitanje veruju li u americki san, sto je bio veci pozitivan odaziv od proseka opste populacije. U Europi - - bedak, oko 13% je verovalo u europske vrednosti. Idi im objasni kako su glupi, a ti pametan, u znas bolje od njih. Ipak je razmisljanje (sic) i upravljanje tudjim misljenjima i zivotima - - ahem -- vas reon

 

Uzbudio si se Gari, gubis se jos od f92. 

 

 

 

Tipična zamena teza.

To je isto kao kada bi pobijao tezu o rasnoj segregaciji antiratnim protestima zbog rata u Vijetnamu i seksualnim i svakim drugim slobodama. Tako ti sada pokušavaš da očigledni rasizam Trumpa skrajneš spominjanjem tržišne privrede i svuda cenjene visokoobrazovne politike.

Ne znam da li je tih 75 % A. m. dalo potvrdan odgovor da veruje u Trumpov san o autoritarnoj Americi gde će svako ko drugačije misli od njega, pripada drugoj veri i nije belac, biti smatran nepoželjnim u zemlji u koju su btw došli i njegovi otac, majka i žena a čije političke stavove niko od ovdašnjih demokrata ne dovodi u pitanje. Tako je, recimo, Obama mogao da zagovara njegovo iseljavanje u zemlju porekla njegovih roditelja zato što je kritikovao politiku establišmenta.

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Jeste, zeznula sam se, ima 75% amazonovih deonica... 
Desi se to kad hoćeš da poentiraš, po što, po to.

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Just now, mrd said:

Stvarno, ili se zezaš? Ne može ni jedna (state) da ukine fedaralni tax, to samo fedaracija može. Nekada to urade, na godišnjem nivou, za proizvodnju kukuruza, žita: govedine itd. To samo zavisi od trenutne potrebe. Nema nikakve veze sa državom(state) u kojoj je business registrovan. Mnoge male companije iz Cali se registruju u Nevadi, pošto im je manja tax. To nije ništa criminal, samo je hint Cali, kad treba da spusti tax rate, što ona i radi. Nemojmo mešati pojmove, ako nije jasno, daj da razjasnimo.

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mrd, prva linija mog posta kaze isto to, "Illinois (Chicago) nema jurisdikciju da ukine Federalni porez. Ima, da smanji svoj lokalni porez i da tako privuce firme da tamo postave svoje sediste.

Citas batke sa inferiornih uredjaja pa upadas u bioskopsku salu na pola filma i pricas onima koji su od pocetka tu o cemu se radi. Jednostavno, nisi video.

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1 hour ago, A sad said:

 

Ti napisa jedno poduze oprostajno pismo, ali ipak evo te opet. Lepo je sto si se ipak vratio. 

Za ostalo, na netu i u istorijskoj literturi je vrlo lako naci to sto pitas, tako da nema potrebe da ja pisem o tim opste poznatim stvarima. 

 

 

Elem, lepo je videti uhordisane levicare i komuniste kako zele da otimaju tudji novac i vode racuna koliko ko placa u kasu, jer smatraju da nije fer. Ko vas sprečava da budete inovativni i stvorite neki proizvod vitalan za civilizaciju, pa profit podelite siromašnima? Ne ide, a?

Ah, prva godina i omiljena mikroekonomija, ovo je teorija u forumskoj praksi doduse, ali je jednako uzbudljivo citati kako se komunisti upiru da upravljaju tudjom imovinom.

 

Lol. 

Edited by Eddard
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mrd, prva linija mog posta kaze isto to, "Illinois (Chicago) nema jurisdikciju da ukine Federalni porez. Ima, da smanji svoj lokalni porez i da tako privuce firme da tamo postave svoje sediste.
Citas batke sa inferiornih uredjaja pa upadas u bioskopsku salu na pola filma i pricas onima koji su od pocetka tu o cemu se radi. Jednostavno, nisi video.
Kako si ti napisao, sa ček, ček, delovalo je kao da mi spočitavaš, da sam rekao da state menja fedaral tax.
Znači, bioskop ti je ovde suvišan.
Hvala!

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3 minutes ago, mrd said:

Desi se to kad hoćeš da poentiraš, po što, po to.

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Ja i dalje pricam o Amazonu, ali nekako mi se cini da je bilo lakse spinovati moje jedno "on" nego ostati u pravcu gde smo i poceli pricu... 

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1 minute ago, mrd said:

Kako si ti napisao, sa ček, ček, delovalo je kao da mi spočitavaš, da sam rekao da state menja fedaral tax.
Znači, bioskop ti je ovde suvišan.
Hvala!

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Jest, oce to kada se citaju tri reci pa replicira... 

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Jedva cekam da rasista izgubi izbore 2020. da posmatram postepeno okretanje ekipe odavde nazad ka demokratama. Dakle samo se brani vlast USA pa makar bio lik koji tera neistomisljenike u drugu zemlju. Komedija

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1 hour ago, Baby said:

 

Ok, ali kakve su to poreske olaksice da on placa -1% poreza? 😄

Ne bi dzabe tax code imao 70K strana.:classic_smile:

Prodas kucu i na profit od prodaje neces platiti porez ako novac ulozis u kupovinu druge kuce. Jos ako si tu ulozila u neko renoviranje gde postoji rebate...

Diskusija o tome kako im je poslo za rukom je gubljenje vremena, posto u celoj Americi mozda ima 100 ljudi koji bi mogli da analiziraju taj tax return.

Edited by DJORDJE

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8 minutes ago, Ozu said:

Jedva cekam da rasista izgubi izbore 2020. da posmatram postepeno okretanje ekipe odavde nazad ka demokratama. Dakle samo se brani vlast USA pa makar bio lik koji tera neistomisljenike u drugu zemlju. Komedija

Izvinjavam se moderaciji sto krsim rec da necu pisati do sutra ali moram. Isti forumasi na ovom forumu brane Trampa i Vucica tako da ti je konstatacija na mestu. Brani se vlast u USA. Brani se vlast u Srbiji. Od istih forumasa.

Edited by Jonnhy Clash

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16 minutes ago, Ozu said:

Jedva cekam da rasista izgubi izbore 2020. da posmatram postepeno okretanje ekipe odavde nazad ka demokratama. Dakle samo se brani vlast USA pa makar bio lik koji tera neistomisljenike u drugu zemlju. Komedija

 

i ja to jedva cekam,

 

onda bih mirno slusala Aoc a bogami i onu sa hidzabom dan i noc a ne da ih narandjasti tera u tamo neke zabiti da drze govore

 

mozda se ove dame nekome ne svidjaju ali ljudi bi morali da shvate da demokrate nisu znale kako da se osvete trumpu

i osnazili su ove borkinje ne bi li na osnovu njihove boje i religije pridobili sve one koji ne bi glasali za trumpa....

Edited by Mama_mia

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59 minutes ago, melankolic said:

 

Tipična zamena teza.

To je isto kao kada bi pobijao tezu o rasnoj segregaciji antiratnim protestima zbog rata u Vijetnamu i seksualnim i svakim drugim slobodama. Tako ti sada pokušavaš da očigledni rasizam Trumpa skrajneš spominjanjem tržišne privrede i svuda cenjene visokoobrazovne politike.

Ne znam da li je tih 75 % A. m. dalo potvrdan odgovor da veruje u Trumpov san o autoritarnoj Americi gde će svako ko drugačije misli od njega, pripada drugoj veri i nije belac, biti smatran nepoželjnim u zemlji u koju su btw došli i njegovi otac, majka i žena a čije političke stavove niko od ovdašnjih demokrata ne dovodi u pitanje. Tako je, recimo, Obama mogao da zagovara njegovo iseljavanje u zemlju porekla njegovih roditelja zato što je kritikovao politiku establišmenta.

Ma kakva zamena teze, opet tripujes, cak ni veze nema sa postom, jasno sam postavio pitanja, na koja nemas odgovor. 

 

Elem, kazes da je visokokvalifikovana snaga svugde cenjena (u Srbiji recimo postovanje cveta) - - zasto onda Nemacka ne ceni isto kao i SAD? Evo da ti pomognem genije - - zato sto dobar deo nacionalnog dohotka prerasporedjuje, pa nema - - ahem - - sredstava. Ili za tebe - - Nemacka zbog welfare aparata ne moze da plati kao Amerika. 

 

Istrazivanje je uzgred radjeno pod Busom Juniorom, koji je uveliko pokrenuo rat protiv dobrog dela islamskog sveta. 

 

 

Uzgred, kad smo kod zamene teza - - zasto se zene ne lome da emigriraju u Saudijsku Arabiju? Mozda zato sto je tamo za njih - - ahem - - lose. Ovakav trend ne vidimo kod Afro populacije, verovatno zato sto mislis da su glupi i mazohisti, pa ciljano idu u logor zvan USA. Imas jako nisko misljenje o Afrikancima za nekog ko se toboze bori za njihova prava.

 

Ko o cemu... 

 

Edited by McCarthy

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31 minutes ago, DJORDJE said:

Ne bi dzabe tax code imao 70K strana.:classic_smile:

Prodas kucu i na profit od prodaje neces platiti porez ako novac ulozis u kupovinu druge kuce. Jos ako si tu ulozila u neko renoviranje gde postoji rebate...

Diskusija o tome kako im je poslo za rukom je gubljenje vremena, posto u celoj Americi mozda ima 100 ljudi koji bi mogli da analiziraju taj tax return.

 

Nemam ja nista protiv, ali sta ce biti na kraju kada Amazon pokupuje pola US da se spasi taxi 😄

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2 hours ago, Amigo said:

Tako pisu zakone republikanci i desnicari, namjestaju da ne placaju porez, kao to nije njegov porez, nego firme, a on vlasnik svega :capone:

Pitanje je ko tu gubi, pa drzava gubi i time te se onda dodatno zaduzuje da pokrije sve troskove, onda ostali poreski obveznici poslije vracaju te kredite, kamate itd.

Savrsen sistem, ali za koga :cigar:tako da ja razumem njih sto oni pisu takve zakone, ali ne razumem gologuziju koja to podrzava :smiley33:

 

Vidi stvarno je bezveze kad neko nema pojma o temi a voli da diskutuje, pa onda pise gluposti.

Taj IRS kod je pisan decenijama pod razlicitim administracijama, i nema nikakve veze sa desnicarima, nego je to tvoje neznanje. 

Da ne pominjemo da IRS nema politicku orijentaciju, oni samo hoce pare. Lepo sam ti dala misljenje specijalizovanih racunovodja koji kazu da to nema veze sa promenama koje je Tramp uveo 2017 jer je on malo sta promenio.

1 hour ago, DJORDJE said:

Ne bi dzabe tax code imao 70K strana.:classic_smile:

Prodas kucu i na profit od prodaje neces platiti porez ako novac ulozis u kupovinu druge kuce. Jos ako si tu ulozila u neko renoviranje gde postoji rebate...

Diskusija o tome kako im je poslo za rukom je gubljenje vremena, posto u celoj Americi mozda ima 100 ljudi koji bi mogli da analiziraju taj tax return.

Ja sam taj kod jednom citala i proucavala 6 meseci, naravno da ne bih ni pomislila da tvrdim da ga poznajem kao profi poreski advokati, ali mi malo glupo da neko ko u zivotu nije platio porez po US modelu zna da je Amazon "nesto muljao" :classic_biggrin:

Nema to 70 strana - ima mnogo vise.

Evo ovako taj sa prodajom kuce 1031 bese, barem za poslovna lica :classic_smile:

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2 hours ago, Baby said:

 

Nemam ja nista protiv, ali sta ce biti na kraju kada Amazon pokupuje pola US da se spasi taxi 😄

Oni ne kupuju, nego grade infrastrukturu.

 

 

Toliko se svi zaleteli u Bezosa (zinule oci na pare) da su zaboravili da je on Trampov ljuti neprijatelj 😂

A sad ispalo sredio mu Tramp da ne placa porez....

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56 minutes ago, Angelia said:

Vidi stvarno je bezveze kad neko nema pojma o temi a voli da diskutuje, pa onda pise gluposti.

Taj IRS kod je pisan decenijama pod razlicitim administracijama, i nema nikakve veze sa desnicarima, nego je to tvoje neznanje. 

Da ne pominjemo da IRS nema politicku orijentaciju, oni samo hoce pare. Lepo sam ti dala misljenje specijalizovanih racunovodja koji kazu da to nema veze sa promenama koje je Tramp uveo 2017 jer je on malo sta promenio.

 

Ja nisam ni rekao da je to Tramp uveo, nego da je to napisano tako da sto si bogatiji sve manje placas poreza 🤪 a svake godine se drzavni deficit povecava 🤪

 

https://www.cnn.com/2019/07/11/politics/treasury-us-budget-deficit-widens/index.html

 

i ko ce to da plati na kraju, gologuzija 🤪 

 

Desnicari je termin da bocnem malo right wing forumase :lol_2:

 

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3 hours ago, Baby said:

 

Nemam ja nista protiv, ali sta ce biti na kraju kada Amazon pokupuje pola US da se spasi taxi 😄

Onda ce US da se zove SemiAmazonia. :lol_2:

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1 hour ago, Angelia said:

Oni ne kupuju, nego grade infrastrukturu.

 

 

Toliko se svi zaleteli u Bezosa (zinule oci na pare) da su zaboravili da je on Trampov ljuti neprijatelj 😂

A sad ispalo sredio mu Tramp da ne placa porez....

 

Joj bre Andjo, odgovorila sam Djordju za kupovinu i prodaju kuce, znam cime se bavi Jeff ako i ne znam ne cekam tebe da me vodis kroz maglu, nego nadjem sama... mslm kao uciteljica si postala... 

 

Ja mislim da je on genije i svaka mu cast, ali isto tako mislim da ovakve poreske olaksice ne bi trebale da dokace one koji za vikend prave 2 milijarde dolara... 

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24 minutes ago, mrd said:

Onda ce US da se zove SemiAmazonia. :lol_2:

 

Tako nekako 😄

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1 hour ago, Amigo said:

 

Ja nisam ni rekao da je to Tramp uveo, nego da je to napisano tako da sto si bogatiji sve manje placas poreza 🤪 a svake godine se drzavni deficit povecava 🤪

 

 

Vidis zato ja u tvom pisanju imam problem, zato sto pises ovakve besmislice, ukljucujuci to o desnicarima i mislis da si vickast.

Nije napisano da bogati placaju sto manje poreza, nego je to daleko komplikovanije. Pocevsi od toga da neki delovi poreskog zakona imaju ekonomskog smisla, i logike, do nekih koji IRS namerno muti ne bi li prigrabila veci deo novca, a imas i neke koji samo treba da zapuse neki loophole.

I to se sve razvija u jako komplikovan kod, To da firme koriste svoje prethodne gubitke da ofsetuju profit, ima svoju logiku, to i ja mogu kao pojedinac. i tako mozemo stavku po stavku. To sto Amazon dobija rebate za tehnicke kompanije - je opet bila incentive za investicije. Mozda su trebali da razmisle o vremenskom periodu ili ogranicenje, ali logike ima.

Ja sam prva koja kaze da pisce tog koda treba kazniti, barem da napisu objasnjenja svojih zakona, medjutim to nije moguce, jer krivca neces lako naci, ko zna koliko hiljada ljudi je ucestvovali u pravljenju tog koda.

 

1 hour ago, Baby said:

 

Ja mislim da je on genije i svaka mu cast, ali isto tako mislim da ovakve poreske olaksice ne bi trebale da dokace one koji za vikend prave 2 milijarde dolara... 

Jbga jednakost pred zakonom :lol_2:

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Evo za @mrd, Chicago Tribune nas je cuo izgleda 😄 Jasno je meni da se vi tesko ubacujete u tudje cipele i tesko iz svog ugla sagledate kako neki koji su zavrsili studije u US zive...

 

Spoiler

Chicago aldermen may raise the minimum wage to $15. But with the city’s cost of living, is that even enough?

She just received a modest pay raise at her job, but even at $13 an hour, working nearly 40 hours a week, Julia Simone Downs doesn’t earn enough to cover her student loan payments, her cellphone bill and the credit card debt she’s accumulated.

“I live paycheck to paycheck. I work a lot of hours, and I need a second job,” said the 24-year-old who works as a customer service assistant at Buddy Guy’s Legends, a premier blues bar and restaurant in the South Loop. “I find so much purpose in the work I do. It’s an honor to be a part of the blues community and around people who love music.

“Right now, $13 an hour helps, but it isn’t enough to cut it.”

Ald. Sophia King, 4th, introduced an ordinance last month that would gradually lift Chicago’s minimum wage from $13 an hour to $15 an hour at a rate faster than a new state law mandates. Instead of waiting until 2025, which is when the entire state will reach a $15 minimum wage, King wants to give 400,000 of Chicago’s working residents a financial boost by raising their hourly pay $1 next year and another $1 the following year.

Her proposal, which is supported by 36 other aldermen and could be voted on by September, would get Chicago workers to a $15 hourly wage by 2021.

But as King has advocated for the pay increase, by talking it up at meetings, appearing at news conferences surrounded by labor leaders and activists, and authoring letters explaining her reasoning, it has raised a conversation about the rapidly rising cost of living in Chicago.

And it’s left some asking whether $15 an hour is even enough for working families in Chicago to survive.

The discussion about raising Chicago’s minimum wage to $15 comes as it’s also debated nationally. Some presidential candidates have even incorporated the idea into their campaigns.

Downs admits she has it easier than many: She still lives at home with her family and leans on her mother for health insurance. A raise to $15 an hour would help her right now, she says, but how far that will stretch in two years remains to be seen as the cost of nearly everything continues to trend upward.

“I’m pretty frugal. I do budget,” she said. “So many people need to earn more to live with dignity.”

She said she would like to continue working in her current position. But she’d also like to bring home enough money to pay her bills, help her mother cover utility expenses and her mortgage so they don’t have to worry about being priced out of their South Loop community. She’d also like to save enough to eventually live independently.

"I have a bachelor’s, but it doesn’t actually translate into a job or (higher) wage. I can’t work at Goldman Sachs — I was a gender studies major. Even if I could, I shouldn’t have to just to earn a decent living,” she said.

Getting to $15 an hour

The concept of a $15 minimum wage emerged around 2014 when groups of fast-food workers across the country went on strike to demand better pay, mainly from large, profitable corporations, said David Cooper, a senior economic analyst with the Economic Policy Institute who studies and researches the impact of minimum wage laws.

At the time, a $15 hourly wage was considered the minimum amount workers needed to live in major metropolitan areas, Cooper said. But now, some five years after that movement gained attention, in major cities such as Chicago, New York, San Francisco, Boston and Los Angeles, it’s still not enough to afford even a humble lifestyle.

“The truth is, four or five years ago, the idea of setting a minimum wage of $15 seemed so ambitious that folks wrote it off as something that could never happen,” Cooper said. “The fact that we now have legislation in some places, it’s a huge step forward. But that doesn’t necessarily mean it will get workers all the way where they should be."

Raising the minimum wage not only puts more money into workers’ pockets, it stabilizes the workforce because well-paid employees tend to stay at their companies longer, Cooper said. His research shows that raising the minimum wage would lift thousands of workers out of poverty, and help address the wage inequality between lower-wage workers and so-called typical workers that generally earn higher salaries, he said.

Nationally, raising the minimum wage would benefit African Americans and Latinos, who are overwhelmingly in lower-paying positions, Cooper’s research shows.

Still, based on the EPI family budget calculator, which estimates how much money it takes to cover living expenses, residents in Chicago need to earn at least $18.56 an hour to be able to cover rent, utilities, food and transportation, Cooper said.

“If policymakers want people to afford a decent life in Chicago, it makes sense to raise the wage more quickly than the state,” Cooper said. But city officials may have to couple the wage increase with other efforts if they truly want lower-income residents to be able to afford to work and live in Chicago, he said.

“For example, supports through social safety nets,” he said. “Look at any country in Europe, there is much better public housing, subsidized child care. There are ways in which we could make it easier for folks to live easier that doesn't (just) come from a minimum wage.”

Sharon Legenza, the executive director of Housing Action Illinois, echoes a similar sentiment.

When Housing Action began to interrogate the cost of renting an apartment in Chicago, researchers determinedthat workers actually need $23.31 an hour if they want to live here comfortably, she said. That estimate considers the cost of renting an apartment without residents having to spend more than 30 percent of their monthly income on housing.

“It’s really clear that housing costs ... have really outpaced wages, particularly for low-income wage earners,” said Legenza, pointing to the organization’s report, “Out Of Reach,” which was released in June. “Housing is one of the largest expenses people have, and if they are not earning sufficient salaries, then what do you do?

“Wages may need to increase,” Legenza said. “But rents are also really high. So the question we must ask is, ‘How do we create more less expensive places for people to live in Chicago?’”

Addressing low wages is one step, but housing costs should be a part of the conversation too, Legenza said.

‘We are at war against poverty’

For George White, 64, it’s rent, gas, electricity and monthly transit fare cards that eat up his entire paycheck. White works full-time offering hands-on home care for sick and disabled clients.

Even with steady work, he struggles to make ends meet.

“I mainly buy fast food, if I catch the McDonald’s sale or Burger King sale — the two for one,” he said. “I buy beans, rice and try to keep bread from Aldi or Food 4 Less. I keep my coupons. Larger stores are out of the question.”

When White first started working in home health care, he was earning $10 an hour, he said, and his union representative confirmed. In 2017, along with other lower-wage workers in the state, he got a pay raise to $11. Now he’s earning $13 an hour, which doesn’t solve all his financial problems but does give his budget some wiggle room, he said.

“Before, I was buying secondhand clothes exclusively,” he said. “Now, every now and then, I’m able to get something new. And every now and then I can pay a utility bill in full.”

Even at his $13-an-hour pay rate, White has to use nearly all of one of his two monthly paychecks on the $900 rent at his Chicago Lawn apartment. He makes small payments on his light and gas bills — just enough to keep the services from being disconnected. Any extra money he finds in his budget, he uses to buy a roast or a steak to treat his wife and two children to a nice home-cooked meal, he said.

“We are at a war against poverty. Personally, I’m tired of it,” White said. “The push for higher pay isn’t just for myself. I have three generations of family behind me. I want them to have a better life and better opportunities.

“Really, the cost of living should determine the raises,” he continued. “The business owners that say they can’t afford it — I would like for them to try to live off the salary that is given to me and see what their lives would be like. I’m not talking about driving a Cadillac or living in a condominium. I just want to be able to pay rent and necessities.”

More cities are on the pathway toward a $15 minimum wage, but that pay raise doesn’t come without consequences, said Rachel Greszler, a research fellow at the Heritage Foundation, a conservative think tank.

When the minimum wage is increased, most companies will follow the law, Greszler said. But then workers’ hours get cut so they still earn less. Some will lay off vulnerable employees and shift to a smaller work staff. Others will turn to automation and other ways to cut their labor force.

Greszler points to both data collected from cities like Seattle, where the hourly wage has increased, and anecdotal evidence to support her claim and concern.

“I’ve noticed in my local McDonald’s, while you can still order from a cashier, there are four computer kiosks to place your order,” said Greszler, who lives in the Washington, D.C., area. “There is only one person working, whereas there used to be three or four.”

In her work, Greszler cautions against looking at the wage issue too narrowly but says instead lawmakers should look at the bigger picture.

“The minimum wage is not supportive for single mothers,” she said. “It’s not meant to be a career — it’s a stepping stone.”

Fast-food workers should graduate on to higher-paid positions in other fields, and they could, if steered to the proper training programs. She offers the Earned Income Tax Credit as another solution to battle poverty and wage stagnation.

“If you do the math, $15 an hour is not enough to live off,” Greszler said. “In general, a vibrant economy is what helps workers. When we have a strong, growing economy … the bottom 10% of workers see their pay go up.”

A Congressional Budget Office reportout this month about what effects raising the minimum wage would have on families found that while family income would increase for low-wage workers, 1.3 million workers would become jobless, according to the CBO estimate. The federal minimum wage of $7.25 per hour has not increased in a decade.

‘A double-edged sword’

The sweet smell of sugar and butter wafts through the air at Abundance Bakery in Bronzeville, where owner Bill Ball sells doughnuts, caramel and red velvet cupcakes, cookies and sweet potato squares, most priced at less than $5.

Ball knows $13 an hour isn’t enough to really live off, he said. So he already pays some of the hardest-working employees on his small staff $15 an hour, he said.

Yet he fears that a mandate of $15 for all will mean adjusting his business model and possibly passing the expense on to his customers.

Yes, workers will earn more, Ball said. But if it means the cost of goods rise, are they actually improving their quality of life?

“In all retail businesses, your biggest expense is labor,” said Ball, who has four part-time employees working with him at his bakery. “I don’t have a problem giving raises. When you’re forced to go higher, it inflates costs.”

So when he learned about the rush toward a wage increase, he became concerned.

“I’m not too thrilled,” he said recently, as he sat in his kitchen trying to configure a Yelp page to attract more business. Ball had questions: Will there be tax breaks for small businesses or cuts in the license and permit costs to help offset the expense?

Most days, Noelia Garcia walks to her job at McDonald’s in Cicero to save money on gas, she said.

For 13 years, Garcia has worked cleaning the tables, mopping the lobby, preparing the salads and yogurt parfaits, and managing the food inventory. Last year, she got two pay raises, which put her at $13.45 an hour.

“It was really emotional, because when you get better pay, it is satisfying,” said Garcia, 50, through a Spanish translator. “I was able to have more money to pay for bills and help my mom and kids. I didn’t have a car before. I now have a 2003 Pontiac.”

The pay increases have extended her purchasing power, Garcia said. She admits, however, she thought the extra money would do more.

“It’s not enough to save,” she said. “I get by. Some days, I’m good on my bills, and some days I’m short. Things have gotten more expensive. I try to organize to save money, but it’s just not possible.”

When lower-paid workers get a raise, they typically put that money right back into the economy as Garcia did, said Sylvia Allegretto, a labor economist at the University of California at Berkeley. That’s one justification, her studies show, for lifting that mandated minimum.

“When you help workers, you help them and their communities thrive,” Allegretto said. “What we know for sure is when you increase wages … you decrease poverty. You have to keep in mind that this debate isn’t just Chicago and Illinois. For the longest length of time, the federal minimum wage has stayed the same — $7.25 an hour. Even though Chicago is moving, large parts of the country have not.”

Too often, when the conversation about wages arises, the pushback focuses on job loss, Allegretto said. But more of the benefits should be considered, she argues. Hours can get cut, but working less for more money can be a good thing, she said. Some jobs will be eliminated, she said. But most working people will get a salary boost because raising the minimum wage has a ripple effect to other workers.

“In my view, there is too little money in the hands of too many people,” she said. "The minimum wage is a remedy and an available policy lever that can immediately mitigate inequality.

“In the richest country in the world, we have workers not getting ahead,” she added. “It shows us that the economy is broken for far too many workers, their families and entire communities.”

Cooper, the economist from EPI, also dismisses opponents’ arguments that businesses will close or shutter if wages increase.

"Cities and states have raised their minimum wages hundreds of times and the sky hasn’t fallen,” Cooper said.

Ras Sekou Tafari, an editor and publisher who operates Frontline Books in Hyde Park, calls the proposed minimum wage increase a “double-edged sword.”

On one hand, raising wages is a strain for small businesses like his bookstore, he said. Yet he firmly believes workers should earn a living wage that keeps them and their families healthy.

“I look at it from a social service, a moralistic perspective,” said Tafari, who doesn’t like to call himself the owner of the bookstore but rather the “conceptualizer.” He employs two workers but prefers to consider them partners that work with, not for, him.

“Even $15 is not enough money for a person who has rent, who has a car note, insurance, utilities, who has to buy food. Fifteen dollars an hour sounds like a lot, but it’s still like living in poverty,” he said.

To relieve smaller, lower-profit businesses of the burden, Tafari supports a government wage subsidy. Instead of forcing small business owners to shoulder the cost of pay increases, the city could pay workers an additional amount to get their salaries above the poverty line.

“The cost of food is going up. The cost of petrol (gasoline) is going up. The value of labor is being minimized,” he said.

“I will say, without apology, a minimum wage is hard for a small business to pay. But nobody in Chicago can live on less than $20 an hour. When that reality sets in, there’s a morality question that we must ask ourselves.”

3

 

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14 minutes ago, Angelia said:

Vidis zato ja u tvom pisanju imam problem, zato sto pises ovakve besmislice, ukljucujuci to o desnicarima i mislis da si vickast.

Nije napisano da bogati placaju sto manje poreza, nego je to daleko komplikovanije. Pocevsi od toga da neki delovi poreskog zakona imaju ekonomskog smisla, i logike, do nekih koji IRS namerno muti ne bi li prigrabila veci deo novca, a imas i neke koji samo treba da zapuse neki loophole.

I to se sve razvija u jako komplikovan kod, To da firme koriste svoje prethodne gubitke da ofsetuju profit, ima svoju logiku, to i ja mogu kao pojedinac. i tako mozemo stavku po stavku. To sto Amazon dobija rebate za tehnicke kompanije - je opet bila incentive za investicije. Mozda su trebali da razmisle o vremenskom periodu ili ogranicenje, ali logike ima.

Ja sam prva koja kaze da pisce tog koda treba kazniti, barem da napisu objasnjenja svojih zakona, medjutim to nije moguce, jer krivca neces lako naci, ko zna koliko hiljada ljudi je ucestvovali u pravljenju tog koda.

 

Kazem ja, Amerika je bezgresna :lol_2:

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Evo za [mention=93]mrd[/mention], Chicago Tribune nas je cuo izgleda  Jasno je meni da se vi tesko ubacujete u tudje cipele i tesko iz svog ugla sagledate kako neki koji su zavrsili studije u US zive...
 
Spoiler

Chicago aldermen may raise the minimum wage to $15. But with the city’s cost of living, is that even enough?

She just received a modest pay raise at her job, but even at $13 an hour, working nearly 40 hours a week, Julia Simone Downs doesn’t earn enough to cover her student loan payments, her cellphone bill and the credit card debt she’s accumulated.

“I live paycheck to paycheck. I work a lot of hours, and I need a second job,” said the 24-year-old who works as a customer service assistant at Buddy Guy’s Legends, a premier blues bar and restaurant in the South Loop. “I find so much purpose in the work I do. It’s an honor to be a part of the blues community and around people who love music.

“Right now, $13 an hour helps, but it isn’t enough to cut it.”

Ald. Sophia King, 4th, introduced an ordinance last month that would gradually lift Chicago’s minimum wage from $13 an hour to $15 an hour at a rate faster than a new state law mandates. Instead of waiting until 2025, which is when the entire state will reach a $15 minimum wage, King wants to give 400,000 of Chicago’s working residents a financial boost by raising their hourly pay $1 next year and another $1 the following year.

Her proposal, which is supported by 36 other aldermen and could be voted on by September, would get Chicago workers to a $15 hourly wage by 2021.

But as King has advocated for the pay increase, by talking it up at meetings, appearing at news conferences surrounded by labor leaders and activists, and authoring letters explaining her reasoning, it has raised a conversation about the rapidly rising cost of living in Chicago.

And it’s left some asking whether $15 an hour is even enough for working families in Chicago to survive.

The discussion about raising Chicago’s minimum wage to $15 comes as it’s also debated nationally. Some presidential candidates have even incorporated the idea into their campaigns.

Downs admits she has it easier than many: She still lives at home with her family and leans on her mother for health insurance. A raise to $15 an hour would help her right now, she says, but how far that will stretch in two years remains to be seen as the cost of nearly everything continues to trend upward.

“I’m pretty frugal. I do budget,” she said. “So many people need to earn more to live with dignity.”

She said she would like to continue working in her current position. But she’d also like to bring home enough money to pay her bills, help her mother cover utility expenses and her mortgage so they don’t have to worry about being priced out of their South Loop community. She’d also like to save enough to eventually live independently.

"I have a bachelor’s, but it doesn’t actually translate into a job or (higher) wage. I can’t work at Goldman Sachs — I was a gender studies major. Even if I could, I shouldn’t have to just to earn a decent living,” she said.

Getting to $15 an hour

The concept of a $15 minimum wage emerged around 2014 when groups of fast-food workers across the country went on strike to demand better pay, mainly from large, profitable corporations, said David Cooper, a senior economic analyst with the Economic Policy Institute who studies and researches the impact of minimum wage laws.

At the time, a $15 hourly wage was considered the minimum amount workers needed to live in major metropolitan areas, Cooper said. But now, some five years after that movement gained attention, in major cities such as Chicago, New York, San Francisco, Boston and Los Angeles, it’s still not enough to afford even a humble lifestyle.

“The truth is, four or five years ago, the idea of setting a minimum wage of $15 seemed so ambitious that folks wrote it off as something that could never happen,” Cooper said. “The fact that we now have legislation in some places, it’s a huge step forward. But that doesn’t necessarily mean it will get workers all the way where they should be."

Raising the minimum wage not only puts more money into workers’ pockets, it stabilizes the workforce because well-paid employees tend to stay at their companies longer, Cooper said. His research shows that raising the minimum wage would lift thousands of workers out of poverty, and help address the wage inequality between lower-wage workers and so-called typical workers that generally earn higher salaries, he said.

Nationally, raising the minimum wage would benefit African Americans and Latinos, who are overwhelmingly in lower-paying positions, Cooper’s research shows.

Still, based on the EPI family budget calculator, which estimates how much money it takes to cover living expenses, residents in Chicago need to earn at least $18.56 an hour to be able to cover rent, utilities, food and transportation, Cooper said.

“If policymakers want people to afford a decent life in Chicago, it makes sense to raise the wage more quickly than the state,” Cooper said. But city officials may have to couple the wage increase with other efforts if they truly want lower-income residents to be able to afford to work and live in Chicago, he said.

“For example, supports through social safety nets,” he said. “Look at any country in Europe, there is much better public housing, subsidized child care. There are ways in which we could make it easier for folks to live easier that doesn't (just) come from a minimum wage.”

Sharon Legenza, the executive director of Housing Action Illinois, echoes a similar sentiment.

When Housing Action began to interrogate the cost of renting an apartment in Chicago, researchers determinedthat workers actually need $23.31 an hour if they want to live here comfortably, she said. That estimate considers the cost of renting an apartment without residents having to spend more than 30 percent of their monthly income on housing.

“It’s really clear that housing costs ... have really outpaced wages, particularly for low-income wage earners,” said Legenza, pointing to the organization’s report, “Out Of Reach,” which was released in June. “Housing is one of the largest expenses people have, and if they are not earning sufficient salaries, then what do you do?

“Wages may need to increase,” Legenza said. “But rents are also really high. So the question we must ask is, ‘How do we create more less expensive places for people to live in Chicago?’”

Addressing low wages is one step, but housing costs should be a part of the conversation too, Legenza said.

‘We are at war against poverty’

For George White, 64, it’s rent, gas, electricity and monthly transit fare cards that eat up his entire paycheck. White works full-time offering hands-on home care for sick and disabled clients.

Even with steady work, he struggles to make ends meet.

“I mainly buy fast food, if I catch the McDonald’s sale or Burger King sale — the two for one,” he said. “I buy beans, rice and try to keep bread from Aldi or Food 4 Less. I keep my coupons. Larger stores are out of the question.”

When White first started working in home health care, he was earning $10 an hour, he said, and his union representative confirmed. In 2017, along with other lower-wage workers in the state, he got a pay raise to $11. Now he’s earning $13 an hour, which doesn’t solve all his financial problems but does give his budget some wiggle room, he said.

“Before, I was buying secondhand clothes exclusively,” he said. “Now, every now and then, I’m able to get something new. And every now and then I can pay a utility bill in full.”

Even at his $13-an-hour pay rate, White has to use nearly all of one of his two monthly paychecks on the $900 rent at his Chicago Lawn apartment. He makes small payments on his light and gas bills — just enough to keep the services from being disconnected. Any extra money he finds in his budget, he uses to buy a roast or a steak to treat his wife and two children to a nice home-cooked meal, he said.

“We are at a war against poverty. Personally, I’m tired of it,” White said. “The push for higher pay isn’t just for myself. I have three generations of family behind me. I want them to have a better life and better opportunities.

“Really, the cost of living should determine the raises,” he continued. “The business owners that say they can’t afford it — I would like for them to try to live off the salary that is given to me and see what their lives would be like. I’m not talking about driving a Cadillac or living in a condominium. I just want to be able to pay rent and necessities.”

More cities are on the pathway toward a $15 minimum wage, but that pay raise doesn’t come without consequences, said Rachel Greszler, a research fellow at the Heritage Foundation, a conservative think tank.

When the minimum wage is increased, most companies will follow the law, Greszler said. But then workers’ hours get cut so they still earn less. Some will lay off vulnerable employees and shift to a smaller work staff. Others will turn to automation and other ways to cut their labor force.

Greszler points to both data collected from cities like Seattle, where the hourly wage has increased, and anecdotal evidence to support her claim and concern.

“I’ve noticed in my local McDonald’s, while you can still order from a cashier, there are four computer kiosks to place your order,” said Greszler, who lives in the Washington, D.C., area. “There is only one person working, whereas there used to be three or four.”

In her work, Greszler cautions against looking at the wage issue too narrowly but says instead lawmakers should look at the bigger picture.

“The minimum wage is not supportive for single mothers,” she said. “It’s not meant to be a career — it’s a stepping stone.”

Fast-food workers should graduate on to higher-paid positions in other fields, and they could, if steered to the proper training programs. She offers the Earned Income Tax Credit as another solution to battle poverty and wage stagnation.

“If you do the math, $15 an hour is not enough to live off,” Greszler said. “In general, a vibrant economy is what helps workers. When we have a strong, growing economy … the bottom 10% of workers see their pay go up.”

A Congressional Budget Office reportout this month about what effects raising the minimum wage would have on families found that while family income would increase for low-wage workers, 1.3 million workers would become jobless, according to the CBO estimate. The federal minimum wage of $7.25 per hour has not increased in a decade.

‘A double-edged sword’

The sweet smell of sugar and butter wafts through the air at Abundance Bakery in Bronzeville, where owner Bill Ball sells doughnuts, caramel and red velvet cupcakes, cookies and sweet potato squares, most priced at less than $5.

Ball knows $13 an hour isn’t enough to really live off, he said. So he already pays some of the hardest-working employees on his small staff $15 an hour, he said.

Yet he fears that a mandate of $15 for all will mean adjusting his business model and possibly passing the expense on to his customers.

Yes, workers will earn more, Ball said. But if it means the cost of goods rise, are they actually improving their quality of life?

“In all retail businesses, your biggest expense is labor,” said Ball, who has four part-time employees working with him at his bakery. “I don’t have a problem giving raises. When you’re forced to go higher, it inflates costs.”

So when he learned about the rush toward a wage increase, he became concerned.

“I’m not too thrilled,” he said recently, as he sat in his kitchen trying to configure a Yelp page to attract more business. Ball had questions: Will there be tax breaks for small businesses or cuts in the license and permit costs to help offset the expense?

Most days, Noelia Garcia walks to her job at McDonald’s in Cicero to save money on gas, she said.

For 13 years, Garcia has worked cleaning the tables, mopping the lobby, preparing the salads and yogurt parfaits, and managing the food inventory. Last year, she got two pay raises, which put her at $13.45 an hour.

“It was really emotional, because when you get better pay, it is satisfying,” said Garcia, 50, through a Spanish translator. “I was able to have more money to pay for bills and help my mom and kids. I didn’t have a car before. I now have a 2003 Pontiac.”

The pay increases have extended her purchasing power, Garcia said. She admits, however, she thought the extra money would do more.

“It’s not enough to save,” she said. “I get by. Some days, I’m good on my bills, and some days I’m short. Things have gotten more expensive. I try to organize to save money, but it’s just not possible.”

When lower-paid workers get a raise, they typically put that money right back into the economy as Garcia did, said Sylvia Allegretto, a labor economist at the University of California at Berkeley. That’s one justification, her studies show, for lifting that mandated minimum.

“When you help workers, you help them and their communities thrive,” Allegretto said. “What we know for sure is when you increase wages … you decrease poverty. You have to keep in mind that this debate isn’t just Chicago and Illinois. For the longest length of time, the federal minimum wage has stayed the same — $7.25 an hour. Even though Chicago is moving, large parts of the country have not.”

Too often, when the conversation about wages arises, the pushback focuses on job loss, Allegretto said. But more of the benefits should be considered, she argues. Hours can get cut, but working less for more money can be a good thing, she said. Some jobs will be eliminated, she said. But most working people will get a salary boost because raising the minimum wage has a ripple effect to other workers.

“In my view, there is too little money in the hands of too many people,” she said. "The minimum wage is a remedy and an available policy lever that can immediately mitigate inequality.

“In the richest country in the world, we have workers not getting ahead,” she added. “It shows us that the economy is broken for far too many workers, their families and entire communities.”

Cooper, the economist from EPI, also dismisses opponents’ arguments that businesses will close or shutter if wages increase.

"Cities and states have raised their minimum wages hundreds of times and the sky hasn’t fallen,” Cooper said.

Ras Sekou Tafari, an editor and publisher who operates Frontline Books in Hyde Park, calls the proposed minimum wage increase a “double-edged sword.”

On one hand, raising wages is a strain for small businesses like his bookstore, he said. Yet he firmly believes workers should earn a living wage that keeps them and their families healthy.

“I look at it from a social service, a moralistic perspective,” said Tafari, who doesn’t like to call himself the owner of the bookstore but rather the “conceptualizer.” He employs two workers but prefers to consider them partners that work with, not for, him.

“Even $15 is not enough money for a person who has rent, who has a car note, insurance, utilities, who has to buy food. Fifteen dollars an hour sounds like a lot, but it’s still like living in poverty,” he said.

To relieve smaller, lower-profit businesses of the burden, Tafari supports a government wage subsidy. Instead of forcing small business owners to shoulder the cost of pay increases, the city could pay workers an additional amount to get their salaries above the poverty line.

“The cost of food is going up. The cost of petrol (gasoline) is going up. The value of labor is being minimized,” he said.

“I will say, without apology, a minimum wage is hard for a small business to pay. But nobody in Chicago can live on less than $20 an hour. When that reality sets in, there’s a morality question that we must ask ourselves.”

3  

Sluaj ovamo:"Prijatno najstarija"
Šta tebi nije jasno? Da rade ljudi za $15, 2001-2002 inženjeri su radili dva posla da bi pokrivali mesečne rate i onda dobijali poslove u struci i nikom ništa. Niko ne kaže da je lako, ali radom se prevazilaze problemi.
Hajde da te pitam, šta ti misliš, koliko će da pomogne satnica od $20?
Da li je to rešenje?

Sent from my LM-G710VM using Tapatalk

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27 minutes ago, mrd said:

Sluaj ovamo:"Prijatno najstarija"
Šta tebi nije jasno? Da rade ljudi za $15, 2001-2002 inženjeri su radili dva posla da bi pokrivali mesečne rate i onda dobijali poslove u struci i nikom ništa. Niko ne kaže da je lako, ali radom se prevazilaze problemi.
Hajde da te pitam, šta ti misliš, koliko će da pomogne satnica od $20?
Da li je to rešenje?

Sent from my LM-G710VM using Tapatalk
 

 

Prvo, nemoj mi se tako obracati, ne placas mi ti racune da bi se tako obracao. 

Drugo, sigurno ce da pomogne vise nego 7 ili 13, ali kada korporacije koje prave milijarde izrabljuju one sa diplomama placajuci ih ispod svake granice, onda drzava mora bar nesto da propise, jer ako ne propise oni ce i dalje nastaviti.... mislim, imas na kraju teksta koje sam milijardu posto sigurna da nisi ni procitao dalje od prvog pasusa... 

 

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45 minutes ago, Baby said:

 

Prvo, nemoj mi se tako obracati, ne placas mi ti racune da bi se tako obracao. 

Drugo, sigurno ce da pomogne vise nego 7 ili 13, ali kada korporacije koje prave milijarde izrabljuju one sa diplomama placajuci ih ispod svake granice, onda drzava mora bar nesto da propise, jer ako ne propise oni ce i dalje nastaviti.... mislim, imas na kraju teksta koje sam milijardu posto sigurna da nisi ni procitao dalje od prvog pasusa... 

 

Ti se bacas parolama, ja rekoh ova je bas prikladna za ovu diskusiju. 

Da li je tebi jasno da ti sve vreme pricas o prezivljavanju u koje guras ove ljude, a ja govorim o zivotu. Da se bacim u tudje cipele danas, a bio sam pre 20 god. Da imam posao koji mi donosi $15 na sat, tukao bih 2 smene posto sa tih $240 dnevno mogu nesto da planiram, a sa $120 samo cekam sledeci dan ne li pote zaradio $120. Kapiras li ti koncept iza te male satnice. Nije mi jasno sto ti ne mozes da se stavis u moje cipele i ukapiras da je moguce raditi 2.5 smene, ne dugo, ali je moguce. 

Dakle tih $20 na sat nista ne znaci za nekoga ko se oslanja samo na tu satnicu. Slicnu smo diskusiju imali i na penzionom fondu. Shvati, drzava, drzavni fondovi, to nikome nista nikada nije donelo, osim prezivljavanja. Zato u se i u svoje kljuse, stavi se u cizme od 7 milja i zaradi za zivot.

 

 

Pretpostavljam da shvatas da i ako sam pisao kao da se obracam tebi u sustini bi to bilo obracanje nekome ko hoce da cuje sta mu se govori. Znaci nije tebi nego nekom drugom.

 

Ziva bila i promenila cipele. :)

 

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